Support/Archive/2009/1

The pages in this archive are:

Messages needing PLURAL
--Purodha Blissenbach 12:27, 28 December 2008 (UTC)
 * ✅ with mwr:45122. --Purodha Blissenbach 13:19, 28 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Not really: you missed "The following images were not found: $1" in . Siebrand 21:04, 28 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes. I did alter the message, but at the wrong place. Corrected with mwr:45156. There are two occurrences of PLURAL now. The fix could be better, if I had found out, how to count the images actually requested, but I could not find a count of good ones. Yet I did not want to spent too much time on it now. --Purodha Blissenbach 11:08, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Messages that should allow &amp;nbsp; inside
--Purodha Blissenbach 15:27, 28 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I think I may know why you'd want this, but I also think you should share the reason. Siebrand 16:12, 28 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Of course. They are column headers of very slim columns, which means that with most browser window sizes, they'll wrap to multiple lines. I'd like to suggest mentioning the meanings of 0's and 1's in a manner like this:

transclusions via interwiki links: 1:&amp;nbsp;allowed, 0:&amp;nbsp;not&amp;nbsp;allowed
 * which is a bit more flexible than using s which cause multiple lines even if the window width does not reequire it.--Purodha Blissenbach 22:23, 28 December 2008 (UTC)
 * How about changing the actual values to something that doesn't need more explanation? – Nike 08:45, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I don't understand, what you might want to say. You do not suggest altering the contents of the column (i.e. 0, or 1) to something else, do you?
 * A more general remark: I do not seem to understand why, for the messages rendered as normal html, there should be a restriction using html entities. Replacing them even appears to me to be unneccessarily causing more server workload. Ok, many html entities are not really needed because we can use UTF-8, but that does not work for &amp;nbsp; --Purodha Blissenbach 11:09, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Is there possibility of confusion where it refers in  – the proposal or the page? Is five days a thing that will not change? And third, is administrator a poor term term here? Does contest mean oppose or question the page's deletion? – Nike 19:23, 28 December 2008 (UTC)
 * proposal or page: the page will be deleted.
 * five days static:  is the setting in DeleteQueue.php. I guess you could add a reference there to a system message. I discussed this with Andrew on IRC around the time he committed this. I see no easy way around this, unless the "day" will be a mandatory unit, in which case this message could be made synamic. Siebrand 10:18, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
 * administrator a poor term term: nope. It is the standard terminology for a user with sysop rights, and the default role that can delete pages. Siebrand 10:05, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
 * what does contest mean: to oppose. Siebrand 10:05, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Can has documentation kthx bye – Nike 19:59, 28 December 2008 (UTC)
 * All parameters are static.
 * $1 is "http://settings.messenger.live.com/applications/CreateHtml.aspx"
 * $2 is "invitee="
 * $3 is "@apps.messenger"
 * Siebrand 10:27, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

What is $1 in ? A user name? --Purodha Blissenbach 07:32, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
 * $1 is any of the messages starting with "top-fans-stats-" and the name of the statistic. Examples are, , , , and . Siebrand 10:15, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

I believe, has a problem. It is apparently used when paging noticeboard messages. It seems to be mixing message counts and message numbers. As it is currently set, it will be able to yield:
 * Showing message 1 of 1

but will fail in all other instances of only 1 message shown, e.g.
 * Showing message 11 of 11

would never appear, though it should. I remember having pointed to the very same sort of problem elsewhere, which has meanwhile been easily fixed, but I do not currently remember when and where that was. Likely, code, and messages, of this instance were "borroughed" from elsewhere, and also likely, this "elsewhere" is the place mentioned, where the problem has been fixed meanwhile. --Purodha Blissenbach 08:29, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Reported as bug 16826 — Untangle mixed use of message count / message numbers. --Purodha Blissenbach 08:46, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
 * This is an extension that originates from Wikia. From what I have seen from their code, it is both messy and very poor from an i18n point of view. I do not particularly feel like fixing it. Did make fixes for DeleteBatch and RefreshSpecial from the same source lately. Siebrand 08:52, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
 * ✅, solved with mwr:45150 (once I remembered the method of recent fix) Honestly, I wasn't expecting it to be that easy, and me to be that quick. Else, I'd avoided reporting, and just done it. --Purodha Blissenbach 09:05, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

The current definition seems misleading. Transliteration would be more correct or just say that arabic numbers are converted to the corresponding number symbols in target languages. – Nike 09:41, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
 * ✅ mwr:45155. Siebrand 10:25, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Wouldn't it be even more precise to write numerals or digits rather than numbers? --Purodha Blissenbach 11:31, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Message needing PLURAL
--Purodha Blissenbach 13:06, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
 * — $3 page(s)
 * Not relating to this exactly, but I'd like to note that bare wfMsg is not enough for plural support. – Nike 13:12, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Extension ReplaceText has 5 messages that need changes for plural support. I'll do some work on that. Siebrand 14:12, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I have a local patch ready and tested. As svn.wikimedia.org is down at the moment, I cannot commit it yet. Siebrand 15:47, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
 * ✅ mwr:45157. Siebrand 18:30, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

What $1 means? --fryed-peach 19:22, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
 * $1 is a user name. Siebrand 19:25, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks for your quick answer! --fryed-peach 19:31, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

VocTrain and PLURAL
e.g. imho sould be using PLURAL, but I doubt that it is supported by the software, anyways. --Purodha Blissenbach 16:07, 30 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Voctrain is a different application, using an API to OmegaWiki. It has no support for plurals. The code is in MediaWiki svn, though (extensions\Wikidata\util\voctrain). I'll communicate this funtional shortcoming to the OmegaWiki guys... Siebrand 16:13, 30 December 2008 (UTC)
 * We are working on OmegaWiki mark II, this means that the code needs to be overhauled anyway. This may happen when OW II is ready :) Thanks, GerardM 16:22, 30 December 2008 (UTC)

Serbian Portal
Serbian is in two scripts and consequently there are two localisations. Sadly, it seems to me that the information on the Portal is wrong. Thanks, GerardM 17:13, 30 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Bug reports should contain (a) steps to reproduce (b) observed behaviour and (c) expected behaviour. None of these were present int he above. That is a Bad Thing (TM). Even though that is a fact, I think I may have fixed it. Siebrand 19:52, 30 December 2008 (UTC)


 * People should not translate for "sr", consequently the sr Babel should be either be sr-el or sr-ec or both. The statistics should not be for sr either. This is probably true for several other languages with multiple orthographies. GerardM 09:20, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Babel does not support script or orthography variants. You should address your issue at the Babel extension developer. Siebrand 09:52, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
 * This is one of the things, I want Babel to "learn", so it's on my agenda for next year, too. ;-)
 * My basic idea, in the instance of, is to (1) add   and  , and (2) amend  , that it internally calls for both   and  . Likewise with other languages having multiple standard scripts.
 * Other than using different ISO codes where available, I have no suggestion regarding dialectal variants.  has two, being too close to each other to make a point dealing with them on the Babel level, imho. ,  , and  , e.g. are different. --Purodha Blissenbach 10:40, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Just FYI: This does not make Babel bad. It makes it incomplete. The current Babel design explicitely excluded this feature in its first version. Of course anyone can feel free to add features to the current version. This would probably also require extension CLDR to contain more information from CLDR than it does now. Siebrand 14:27, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
 * 100% agreed. Afaik, we can get script (and some other subtag) infos to some extent from http://www.iana.org/assignments/language-subtag-registry but that is not sufficient. --Purodha Blissenbach 23:45, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

What context for that message? --fryed-peach 17:30, 30 December 2008 (UTC)
 * This is an option for whitelist entry expiry date: never [expire]. Siebrand 21:03, 30 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks. --fryed-peach 17:40, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

Conflict of special page names
The two extensions CentralAuth and Global user rights have the pages of the same name (GlobalUserRights). Is this intentional? If yes, how can we translate them? --fryed-peach 17:24, 30 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I have disabled localisation of the special page name for GlobalUserRights until it would be changed to no longer conflict with CentralAuth's special page name. Siebrand 21:04, 30 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Re-enabled again. The two extensions are incompatible by default, so them having the same special page aliases may appear to be confusing, but is perfectly valid. Siebrand 14:29, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

using the "fallback" for Special:Translate
In my opinion it is very useful, if the Special:Translate use the "fallback" for the shown language. For example the localization auf de-formal show englisch message, but so I cannot find (in a easy way) message who need a formal-translation. That very easier when shown the de-message. It is possible? Der Umherirrende 14:06, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I agree with the feature request, but it is an edge case. de-formal is one of less than a handful localisations that by definition does not need to be complete. Without looking into it further, it may even be the only case. As we have little to no developer capacity at the moment, this will be given lowest priority. One suggestion: use something like this and search for you/your to check if a de-formal translation needs to be made. Siebrand 14:22, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
 * P.s. do not translate YouTube to IhrTube :) Siebrand 14:23, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Btw, the feature request already exists: "P2 FEATURE: user defined fallback languages". Siebrand 14:25, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

and
I don't like the current markup. Can we use &lt;span&gt; instead of &lt;font&gt;? --fryed-peach 18:29, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Whatever is used, the markup should probably not be in the message. – Nike 18:36, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Agreed. --fryed-peach 18:38, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
 * ✅ mwr:45404. Removed the mark up and moved it to the code. Siebrand 20:21, 4 January 2009 (UTC)

Context? – Nike 12:15, 30 December 2008 (UTC)
 * ✅ Siebrand 19:55, 4 January 2009 (UTC)

Strange behaviour of
I see two sorts of somwhat unsystematic, or unpredictable behaviour of - nothing too wild, but I thought, I let you know: I am using the newest Opera Browser most of the times. --Purodha Blissenbach 16:41, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
 * 1) Every now and then, I receive a series of red messages saying, I should relogin, since my edit could not be saved. (Lost, or wrong edit token, I suppose). This appears, even if I certainly kept my IP Address, it appears in short clusters of up to 10, more usually 3, or 4 times in a row within a minute, or so.
 * We think this is due to a memory condition with APC. We need to (a) update to the latest version and (b) assign some more memory to it. Needs to be planned, but is in the works. Siebrand 17:08, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
 * 1) My usual fallback chain of languages is   →   →  . When I create new messages, most often I have no preset in the   edit field. Yet sometimes, I do, and it may be either of , or  . It appears to me that the preset language is identical over a short time, at least, but depends on the extension (and maybe on the presence or absence of a German localization, but I am not certain about this). I've not made statistics :-( the only thing I can tell for sure is, dat while I am keeping to work on a n extension, the behavious and the preset language, if any, does not, or at least extremely rarely, change.
 * Fallbacks come from messages files, not from the database (mostly/always?). Caching influences the behaviour of displayed fallbacks. Nothing to be done here, I think. Things would get too slow... Siebrand 17:08, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ → Thank you for your good & thorough explanations. --Purodha Blissenbach 08:14, 3 January 2009 (UTC)

"TRL" in that message is a typo for "URL"? If intentional, what meaning? --fryed-peach 17:54, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Typo. Fixed. Siebrand 18:30, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Thank you for your quick response. --fryed-peach 18:43, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

What is $1 in this? --Crt 14:24, 2 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ Siebrand 19:52, 4 January 2009 (UTC)

and
This message use I. I don't think that it's good style to refer to software as person. --EugeneZelenko 16:33, 4 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ mwr:45402. Siebrand 19:42, 4 January 2009 (UTC)

$1? – Nike 12:14, 30 December 2008 (UTC)
 * $1 is a parameter that is not supported (for example manually changed in a URL). It can be anything that has been provided by a client. Siebrand 20:23, 4 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ Siebrand 18:40, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

and
Give me the contexts for those messages, please. --fryed-peach 17:55, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
 * This extension needs a new updates. I have changed the code, but need to do a little testing before I commit. Will be dealt with. Siebrand 19:35, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
 * ✅ mwr:45424. Haven't done anything about the 'never' message. There are too many use cases for this extension, the code looks horrid for all I case, and this was the best I was prepared to do... If you think it needs more work (I think it does), best create a . Siebrand 18:38, 5 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Thank you. --fryed-peach 08:50, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

This message has the line #Leave this line exactly as it is  at the top and something similar at the bottom of the message. Should this be translated? Lloffiwr 19:44, 2 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Nope. Siebrand 20:44, 2 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Oops? I did translate it, and a bunch of similar stuff, assuming that, it was a hint for those who maintain a wiki in their own laguage, who I cannot expect to read English. Is it wrong or just optional, to translate those kinds of comment lines?
 * (forgotten signature added later) --Purodha Blissenbach 02:25, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Please sign your comments. Then the reply on the content: I think it is most important that the hash mark (#) is present and has a space in from of it so it is treated as a comment, and not as a setting. Translating it is not a bad thing. Siebrand 19:09, 3 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅. Yeah, I let all the #'s and html markup in place. --Purodha Blissenbach 19:39, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

Is this right-* message or not? – Nike 20:59, 4 January 2009 (UTC)
 * By definition it is not, because right-messages *always* have an identifier that starts with "right-". Siebrand 21:53, 4 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Checked the code. Message had an incorrect key. It was a right-message. mwr:45406. Siebrand 21:57, 4 January 2009 (UTC)

Isn't the wording here a bit odd? 'Go away'? --Harald Khan Ճ  19:03, 5 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ mwr:45426. Siebrand 20:44, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

I'm not absolutely sure but it seems the help/info message (/qqq) switches meanings of parameters $2 and $3. Malafaya 00:44, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * $page, $add, $sub. It appears to are correct. Please update the documentation. Siebrand 18:45, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

Navigation in : hardly accessible messages
Messages, are not shown in any list you can get to from Special:Translate, no matter which. The only way to access them, unless you know their names, is to navigate to the previous/following of the ones before and after, respectively; or to the following message of , because itself has no message following it. I believe that, these messages should appear in the "optional" list(s). This is not the only instance of messages only accessible via previous/next, but I failed to note the other ones. I can only tell that, they belong to other extensions. --Purodha Blissenbach 02:37, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * That's a bug. Next/previous should not show you ignored messages. Siebrand 12:37, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ Ah, ok, I was stupidly assuming optional messages being not shown where expected, and it is ignored messages shown where not expected :-) nice pun. Nover mind, thats a pretty problemless bug, then. Thanks for letting me know. --Purodha Blissenbach 19:36, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

What is an 'icon link' in this message? Is it a link that appears as an icon? Or is it a link to an icon? Or anything else? Tried finding the information page on this extension on mediawiki but not sure which extension it referred to. Lloffiwr 13:26, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Maybe you can make something out of mw:Extension:Icon? Siebrand 18:26, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

$2 in that message includes the word "Fundraiser" (in English). See. It would be nice if we could translate it. --fryed-peach 14:06, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Cannot be localised at the moment, and I do not know how to. Please create a for this. Related code snippet from ContributionReporting.php below. Siebrand 18:23, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

$egFundraiserStatisticsFundraisers = array(	array( 'id' => '2007', 'title' => '2007 Fundraiser', 'start' => 'Oct 22 2007', 'end' => 'Jan 3 2008' ),	array( 'id' => '2008', 'title' => '2008 Fundraiser', 'start' => 'Nov 4 2008', 'end' => 'Jan 9 2009' ) );
 * Since this one is not very critical, I have decided to live with the current code and modified Japanese translation a bit. Thanks for detailed information. --fryed-peach 18:52, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

I think something like Sorry, help is not implemented yet should sound better in such situation. --EugeneZelenko 15:05, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ mwr:45452. Siebrand 18:19, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

Can't find Simple English?
Although in the drop-down menu on the Main Page, I cannot find any pages for "translating" English into Simple English. Just wondering, as there's four Wikimedia projects with "simple" as the language... and I can't translate! Help! Thanks in advance. Microchip08 15:55, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * OK, I found them. But why is translation disabled? Microchip08 17:44, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Simple English is just English, so it is not getting a localisation. All user interface messages for regular users should be usable for every English speaker. Please inform us of any messages in often used use cases that are unintelligible. Cheers! Siebrand 18:02, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

Database dump
How can I get a full database dump (XML files) of Betawiki? Is it available for download? Thanks. --Meno25 19:00, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * It is not available, and we currently have no plans for it. Siebrand 20:11, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

kea Capeverdian
Capeverdian is a language (kea). We have one person for whom Capeverdian is his native language and Waldir has added the Babel information. It would be good if his Babel localisation actually show up. Thanks, GerardM 09:44, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Code was added locally with fall back to Portugese. Siebrand 11:06, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

What should we do for this message? It was fuzzied once, so I updated it. Then Siebrand reverted my edit and it was fuzzied again. What do these steps mean? Is there any trouble? --fryed-peach 15:18, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I'm not aware of the "why", but Siebrand seems to be putting them back as they were before his reversion today. Maybe it's related to some maintenance task. Malafaya 15:29, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Feature was reverted, message changes were revered, then the feature was reimplemented, and I re-reverted the reverts... Hope you still understand. I am just trying to not have you guys do your work twice... Siebrand 16:03, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I understood. Thank you for your always kind explanation. --fryed-peach 16:19, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

I'm wondering if "House address" wouldn't actually be "Home address" instead. Malafaya 15:23, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
 * That sounds like a proper improvement. ✅ mwr:45504. Siebrand 16:05, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

and
The subject (steward name?) will be put before these messages? --fryed-peach 16:53, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Just a standard log entry (prepended with "17:39, 7 January 2009 Malafaya (Talk | contribs | block)" or some other localised version. Siebrand 17:48, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks. I was too suspicious:) --fryed-peach 18:03, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Shell error 'error while loading shared libraries: libm.so.6'
php sync-group.php --group=core --lang=he Conflict times: 2008-10-21T09:46:22Z - 2008-10-21T09:46:22Z MediaWiki messages svn: error while loading shared libraries: libm.so.6: failed to map segment from shared object: Cannot allocate memory Siebrand 09:47, 21 October 2008 (UTC) It looks like the issue may be resolved by doing the following, but the file to do it to is unknown... Siebrand 09:51, 21 October 2008 (UTC) cp file.bin file.bin.bak

cat file.bin.bak | sed "s/export LD_ASSUME_KERNEL/#xport LD_ASSUME_Kernel/" > file.bin
 * ✅ Fixed this one. – Nike 14:01, 11 January 2009 (UTC)

Can you specify what is each parameter? Thanks a lot! --ToliñoFala aquí comigo 18:41, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * match, user, dbname, time and date, ip. Siebrand 18:43, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ Siebrand 20:04, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Message having a trailing space
Both and  end in two (!) trailing spaces. We cannot enter trailing spaces with, no matter how many; in other words our submissions here are always stored with zero trailing spaces, regardless of our input. --Purodha Blissenbach 19:30, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Looks like some really bad i18n. Needs to be fixed. Siebrand 20:11, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ (by removal) in mwr:45457. Siebrand 20:45, 6 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Just for the records: There are several instances where spaces seemed to be suddenly missing between messages, mostly log entries, which I made bugzilla entries for. Possibly, there are instances of message involved that once had leading/trailing spaces in them. There may be a problem inserting those spaces per layout or per program, since some languages, such as,  ,  ,   and maybe others do not reqire, or even must not have them, sometimes. --Purodha Blissenbach 08:42, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
 * You are not being very specific. Siebrand 09:01, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I know. Currently, Bugzilla does not like me, and I cannot look them up. One I know by heart: In the "fancy recent changes" of the Wikipedia of ripuarian languages, there is no space between page title, and the opening bracket before the "differences" or "$1 differences". --Purodha Blissenbach 19:43, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Really need message names to do something about it, or at least document something needs improvement. Siebrand 19:50, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅. These instances were unrelated and turned out to be a browser bug. --Purodha Blissenbach 09:16, 9 January 2009 (UTC)

A bogus problem report
http://translatewiki.net/w/i.php?title=MediaWiki:Farmer-confirmsetting-text/ksh&action=edit&oldid=980664 has a red "complaint" about $2. It is bogus, however, since the reported link is inside a &lt;nowiki>-bracket. Maybe, it was a good idea to exclude those from inspections? --Purodha Blissenbach 20:24, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
 * &lt;nowiki> does not prevent variable substitution, and thus it makes no sense to ignore parameters in it. The complaint was about the link. – Nike 07:21, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Languages portals
Something happened to the language portals for languages which do not specify variant1 (see Portal:Ka, with the problem; see Portal:Pt without it). The link below the stats graph is not well formed. Malafaya 09:58, 8 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ It seems to be fixed now. Malafaya 19:07, 8 January 2009 (UTC)

db is most likely a prefix or some keyword for database. Maybe this message should be optional? Or what is its meaning otherwise? Malafaya 11:13, 8 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ Actually, it is a column header. Fixed in mwr:45568 Siebrand 17:16, 8 January 2009 (UTC)

has a nonsential link anchor text "here". --Purodha Blissenbach 21:17, 8 January 2009 (UTC) 1 (such "here" should be "there" anyways. A clickable standalone "here" could never ever truly mean mean "here". If it were sending you here, there was not need for a link in the first place)
 * Seems fine to me as of now ("Register your xxxxx here"). Malafaya 23:24, 8 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Indeed, an anchor text "here" of a link is sheer nonsence, each and every guide to web page design lists it as a cardinal sin and calls it a complete nogo. Anchor texts - i.e. the clickable word(s) - must make sense and describe what the link leads you to. "Here" does not. --Purodha Blissenbach 09:00, 9 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Btw., Google knows some 3,000,000,000 pages being linked to with the word "here", and the link following will soon add another one, see here. ;-) --Purodha Blissenbach 09:00, 9 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Usually it's easy to find a good anchor text: delete "here" from the sentence1 and choose the words preceeding it. ("… blah, and please Register your xxxxx") --Purodha Blissenbach 09:00, 9 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ with mwr:45655. --Purodha Blissenbach 23:15, 10 January 2009 (UTC)
 * All right. I misinterpreted your issue :). I thought you were not happy about the grammar :). Malafaya 11:07, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Wuu redirects
Hello,

As we have troubles with special pages redirects on wuu wikipedia I opened a bug. The bug seem to be due to the zh-hans translations that were wrongs, and used by us. For this reason I have created the same page for wuu wikipedia.

I removed the four values that caused troubles, before a good wuu speaker propose a good translation (currently we can't follow recent changes!) Can you tell me first if the file seem correct? (I want to remove translation for Unusedcategories, Unusedtemplates, Recentchanges and Recentchangeslinked.

And if the file is correct, what do I need to do to make the changes availables on wuu wikipedia?

Thanks for your help --Hercule 14:08, 9 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅. This case was handled elsewhere, still pending sync for all affected languages. – Nike 07:16, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Changing messages in English
Hi. If I want to edit an English system message in general (so not only its translation), should/can I do that directly in Betawiki or should I open a bugreport for that? Thanks, --Church of emacs 20:39, 9 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Just propose it here. :) – Nike 21:01, 9 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Well, actually I am just asking how the usual process is. I am sure that I'm not the first person who wished to change an English system message... --Church of emacs 10:43, 10 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Uh, I think I got it now. :) ✅ --Church of emacs 17:27, 10 January 2009 (UTC)

I believe, needs PLURAL so as to properly treat the count of elements in $1. --Purodha Blissenbach 22:28, 9 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ with mwr:45654. --Purodha Blissenbach 22:51, 10 January 2009 (UTC)

Manx (gv) plurals
I'm running into some problems with messages that use singular/plural options. The trouble is that Manx has different possible forms from English:
 * 1,2 - "ta un chaghlaa eddyr oc" (there is one intermediate revision), or in this case, "ta 1 chaghlaa eddyr oc". This uses the singular noun but mutates the first syllable.  This form is also used with multiples of 20, 100 and optionally 1000, as well as anything ending in 1 or 2 (20, 21, 22, 51 etc).
 * 3+ - "ta tree caghlaaghyn eddyr oc" (there are three intermediate revisions), or "ta 3 caghlaaghyn eddyr oc". This uses the plural form with no mutation.  It is used for plurals of 3 or more and can be used for 0 here.

Examples from: http://translatewiki.net/w/i.php?title=MediaWiki:Diff-multi/en

Some messages have been translated using the English form, but it's not ideal. Does anyone have suggestions? -- Shimmin Beg 12:12, 3 January 2009 (UTC)
 * It's necessary to redefine convertPlural function for Manx language. See implementation for Russian as example. See also FAQ. --EugeneZelenko 16:32, 3 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I can do it. Is the following algorithm correct?

param 1: *1 and *2 except 11 and 12; *20 and *100 # What are multiplies of 20? 20, 40, 60...? param 2: everything else param >2: not used – Nike 20:12, 4 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Thanks for your help. Sorry, I didn't think the problem through properly.  Bilingual work is hard... there are in fact three forms.  It would be more, but luckily we use numerals instead of spelling out the numbers.

param 1: Multiples of 20, i.e. 20, 40, 60, 80, 100; by extension multiples of 100, 1000, 1000000 etc. param  2: Anything ending in 1 or 2, i.e. 1, 2, 11, 12, 21, 22, 31, 32... 1001...           (because the 1 and 2 come first in Manx and cause a mutation in the following word) param 3: Everything else.
 * Sorry for the confusion. -- Shimmin Beg 12:20, 10 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Can you check if this is right: http://translatewiki.net/sandwiki/index.php?title=Sandbox5 . Feel free to alter it if you want to provide some real test strings. – Nike 09:50, 11 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Thanks Nike. The work looks fine, but sorry to say I've realised there's another problem (because 1 and 2 mutate slightly differently, if you wondered).  Very sorry, I only spotted this when testing, but could you possible introduce another parameter?

param 1: Multiples of 20, i.e. 20, 40, 60, 80, 100; by extension multiples of 100, 1000, 1000000 etc. param  2: Anything ending in 1, i.e. 1, 11, 21, 31... 1001... param  3: Anything ending in 2 , i.e. 2, 12, 22, 32... 1002... param  4: Everything else.
 * Done, please check again. The results may be cached, in which case try edit+preview to get fresh results. – Nike 13:59, 11 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Cheers Nike, that looks absolutely spot on with my tests. Does anything else need doing? -- Shimmin Beg 22:11, 12 January 2009 (UTC)
 * If you are sure the rules are now correct, I will go ahead and commit the code. Then you can start using it in translations. – Nike 11:00, 13 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I will ask some other Manx users to check it over as I might have missed something. Llofiwr also makes a valid point about possible need for (yet) another form for 0 depending on sentence structure of the messages...  please hold off for now. -- Shimmin Beg 23:31, 13 January 2009 (UTC)
 * It is quite rare that the messages would have 0 in it. Usually it is special case in the code and the message is not displayed and another message is used instead. – Nike 07:24, 14 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Our main sysop has checked this section and agreed with what we have here. If you're happy that 0 won't crop up as an option then we can continue.  Thanks for all your help on this. -- Shimmin Beg 21:52, 15 January 2009 (UTC)


 * ✅. You can start using it now. – Nike 16:51, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks. I've revised the existing pages to follow number rules and I'll carry on when I have time. -- Shimmin Beg 21:05, 16 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Can I ask whether the grammar for 0 is the same as for all other numbers in Manx? The reason I ask is that it is different in Welsh where we say that '(number>0) thing are' but '0 thing are not'. By the way we also have to use a different PLURAL to English - in our case with 6 options! Am very interested to find out about Manx mutations with numbers. Lloffiwr 23:20, 11 January 2009 (UTC)


 * I moved this to your user page as it's not strictly a support question. Hope that's okay. -- Shimmin Beg 22:13, 12 January 2009 (UTC)

Basque language (eu)
I am translating to basque language (euskara) and I don't know how to translate the language names that appear in the search box. I don't know where I can translate them. --An13sa 14:29, 4 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I assume you are talking about the language names like in the dropdown box on Special:Translate. If my assumption is correct, the answer is that you cannot translate those here. We are using data from CLDR for that. You would have to start contributing to CLDR for that. Siebrand 19:32, 4 January 2009 (UTC)

and
What is set mean? Is it noun or verb? --EugeneZelenko 15:21, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Same for and . --EugeneZelenko 15:25, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Verb. Paraphrased it could be "enable editing". Siebrand 18:15, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Actually, I prefer enable editing variant. --EugeneZelenko 15:13, 8 January 2009 (UTC)

Pls help to settle my problem with incorrect languagename display in betawiki main page. It must be in Moksha and correct spelling "мокшеннес". Now it is still in English "Moksha". Thank you Khazar II 15:39, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Please provide a use case, or upload a screenshot with your user language preference set to 'mdf'. MediaWiki uses 'Мокшень'. of where you would expect a different display name. Siebrand 18:13, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

Lower Selisian ( Schläsch)
I saw in the Group statistics, that, ''Lower Selisian (need local name on Support) I believe it to sound similar to the American English word "slash", only modified to "Shlash" --Purodha Blissenbach 08:42, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
 * They call their language Schläsch, according to incubator:/Wp/sli/Hauptseite.
 * I updated the local setting. For now I have very little faith in this localisation when I compare it to standard German. Siebrand 09:00, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I have some passive knowledge of both Lower Silesion (less) and Upper Silesian (better) from contacts with parents of schoolmates of mine who had moved from Silesia to our place. My opinion: some 45% to 50% of the roughly 200 messages in MediaWiki core were taken fom Standard German and are not properly localized atm. I don't know how they work, and how fluent they are with English. Maybe, it's just a step in the translation process, to replace English with something they comprehend better. Maybe my judgement is biased, due to Upper/Lower Silesian distinctions that I am not aware of, and some words of Upper Silesian may be closer to Standard German in writing than I assume from what I heared (and never saw written down) in my childhood. Yet the basic message holds: There is a considerable amount of Standard German messages at the moment.
 * A remark to the translators of Upper Silesian: Don't feel bad about it! It is a transitory state, and there are so many messages. You will finally get them all done, believe me. --Purodha Blissenbach 09:50, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Minor error in Problem report
Not wanting to be picky. There is a minor error in the problem report concerning http://translatewiki.net/w/i.php?title=MediaWiki:Farmer-confirmsetting-text/ksh&action=edit&oldid=980664 -- it lists „ “ but should only show „ “, i.e. less a "|", since that is what is in the message. --Purodha Blissenbach 20:30, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

The N'ko language
I am in contact with people who are preparing for a request for a Wikipedia in the N'ko language (nqo). The guy who is interested in working on this knows French and would like to use gettext for the localisation of the most used messages. What can we do for him ? Thanks, GerardM 21:25, 8 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Nothing. Translations *must* be made based on English source messages when using gettext. The only other option is to use online translations, in which case any number of additional fallbacks can be available. Siebrand 08:13, 9 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Just in case, message order in the gettext export, and LanguageFr.php are the same, if he accepts being bothered with technical stuff that he inadvertantly finds there, he could use the program file http://svn.wikimedia.org/viewvc/mediawiki/trunk/phase3/languages/messages/MessagesFr.php as an additional source for MediaWiki messages - with due caution, of course. --Purodha Blissenbach 09:12, 9 January 2009 (UTC)

Special:UserLogin is the canonicalname and not Special:Userlogin --Der Umherirrende 15:10, 11 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I hope that can be fixed in core (for en and other lang) because I get Warnings about incomplete translations - Following link is problematic: anmelden and the message ist list with problems, but there is not any problem. I know that the link is working, but it is not the defined name and should changed. --Der Umherirrende 20:57, 14 January 2009 (UTC)
 * This is an message from 1.12 branch, where it probably was like that. – Nike 07:24, 15 January 2009 (UTC)
 * A bot has fixed this capitalisation, but it was not fixed in core, that's why I ask. Der Umherirrende 11:01, 17 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Probably a mistake and the bot shouldn't have changed it. Fortunately it doesn't break anything. – Nike 11:15, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

diff- messages
There is a group of core messages starting diff-. Where do these messages appear and what do they do - I can't seem to find them anywhere on English Wikipedia. Lloffiwr 21:00, 12 January 2009 (UTC)
 * They are part of the visual diff feature. It is disabled by default in the current version of MediaWiki because of performance concerns. It is active on Betawiki, though. Siebrand 18:23, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

Gan Wikipedia
Hi, I'm the administrator of Gan wikipedia. Recently we found out that we can no longer check the recent changes on Gan wikipedia, so could you please check out where the problem is? Thank you.--Symane 10:34, 13 January 2009 (UTC)
 * 16940 – Nike 10:59, 13 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Explained this on my talk page as the question was apparently asked 3 times. Siebrand 11:34, 13 January 2009 (UTC)

and
What do those variables mean? --fryed-peach 18:34, 13 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Messages have been documented. Siebrand 18:25, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

Common vocabulary
For a consistent user interface, translators need to agree on a common vocabulary for a given language (i. .e things like "stable version" or "contribution" need to be translated to the same word in all messages). Is there some sort of project or guideline for this on Betawiki? --Tgr 20:54, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Nope, but feel free to create one. – Nike 08:43, 17 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Having translation memory functionality may solve this, but we are nowhere near having it at the moment... Siebrand 18:47, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

Check for quotation symbols consistency
Different countries uses different quotation symbols ("", «», „„, ”“, etc).

I think will be great to have automatic check to allowed quotation symbols (based on language setting). Will be especially helpful to detecting "" sneaking from original messages to translations.

EugeneZelenko 16:48, 17 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Worthwhile idea, but kinda hard to implement. I'm afraid there is too many false positives. – Nike 19:22, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

What follows ? --Purodha Blissenbach 01:47, 8 January 2009 (UTC)
 * From what I can see, it is the label for a dropdown menu. Siebrand 10:55, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

What is $1? --fryed-peach 21:27, 8 January 2009 (UTC)
 * $1 is the name of a supported repository. Siebrand 11:08, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

Wouldn't it be wise, to make a link out of "site administrator" in, so as to assist people in finding the right place to ask? Since SMW is being developed elsewhere, would it be better to file a bug, or can we do such things ourselves? My problem, keeping me from just doing it, I don't know for sure, which URL or page to link to. Is there a difference between "site administrator" and "administrator" and "sysop"? --Purodha Blissenbach 21:53, 9 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Just remove the use of SITENAME. As for the latter: in my opinion there is not, and "administrator" should be used. Also see recent discussion on wikitech-l mailing list. I would not recommend making changes to that terminology just now, I as plan do do that to the complete repo someday soon. Siebrand 12:40, 13 January 2009 (UTC)

Leading space in message
has three lines, starting with (double) spaces each. --Purodha Blissenbach 22:10, 9 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Best check the code to see if they have any meaning. Given the content, I assume this message has property ignored. Siebrand 11:20, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

uses. I do not see a real need for this reference, which as always gives rise to the problem of proper declension, or grammar in general. Thus I suggest avoiding it. Since SMW is developed elsewhere: Can we just alter it, or should I better file a bug, and leave the final say to its developers? --Purodha Blissenbach 12:13, 13 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ (and 2 other messages in the extension) in mwr:46015. Siebrand 11:23, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

Commonist and PLURAL
There are mesages in Commonist, that should imho likely be using PLURAL, e.g. Commonist:ImageList.selected, Commonist:ImageList.loading, Commonist:ImageList.loaded, Commonist:Image.tooltip. Yet they look so different from MediaWiki:-messages that I doubt, PLURAL would be available. What do i do best? --Purodha Blissenbach 09:28, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * If Commoninst uses gettext, PLURAL should be available. If not, it should be improved. --EugeneZelenko 14:55, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * It doesn't. Want to improve it? 128.214.78.153 15:11, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I'm very sorry, but I don't have enough time for that :-( --EugeneZelenko 15:20, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

Tasklist messages
Why Tasklist uses plain %s for arguments instead of numbered parameters? Is PLURAL, SITENAME available for this extension? I think SITENAME should be used in in last case. EugeneZelenko 14:58, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * You are probably right. But as this extension is not maintained at the moment, someone will have to deliver a patch before it is resolved. Currently this is not an i18n/L10n issue, so I suggest you create a issue suggesting improvement. Siebrand 11:26, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

Commonist messages are always started from lower case
Why Commonist messages are always started from lower case? It's definitely inconsistent with style of many UI, including MediaWiki. -- EugeneZelenko 15:24, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I guess no particular reason. Nothing prevents you from using capital letters in translations. I'll discuss about this in English messages with the developer. – Nike 16:39, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

Localization support of ViewAPC
Special:ViewAPC doesn't render Japanese characters properly. See File:ViewAPC.png for example, which is a screenshot of the bottom table titled "Detailed memory usage and fragmentation" at Special:ViewAPC. That special page probably uses and, whose Japanese localizations contain katakana. --fryed-peach 18:14, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Mmm the same problem as with our stats... There doesn't seem to be any sane way to draw text with php. – Nike 18:25, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Could use the same "hack". It does look better, but not perfect still. – Nike 18:37, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Should we make and its friends latin-only? Otherwise, can we have abbreviated forms of them, which would only contain latin letters like "KB", and use them instead in image generations such as ViewAPC? --fryed-peach 06:39, 17 January 2009 (UTC)
 * It would really undermine the purpose of i18n. The drawing code should be fixed. – Nike 08:45, 17 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Please create a bugzilla for this. Siebrand 10:51, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ 17125. Sorry I'm not familiar with bugzilla. --fryed-peach 07:13, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

'Cache full count' translates to 'number of times the cache has been full'? Thanks. --Harald Khan Ճ  11:29, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I think so. --fryed-peach 14:25, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes – Nike 15:06, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

To reduce duplicates
Is it a good idea that we use a message in other messages which contain the text originated from it, like in, to reduce duplicates or inconsistencies? --fryed-peach 14:23, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I am undecided, but you could probably use instead of the plain text. Siebrand 14:46, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
 * In many languages context has so big effect that it is not possible to use inclusion. – Nike 15:07, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

This may be understood wrongly as "upload of php files is disabled" – Nike 16:41, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Actually, that's how I translated it. What is disabled then? File upload through PHP? Malafaya 16:55, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes, the file_upload refers to a php setting, which can be used to disable all file uploads. – Nike 16:59, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
 * This is a message to an operator of the wiki (not a wiki user, who usually cannot alter settings of the server running the wiki)
 * If this message was to be seen by ordinary users, it should be reworded, adding "tell an administrator, that …" or "inform your server operator …", etc. --Purodha Blissenbach 08:57, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
 * You would still have to tell your server administrator if $wgEnableUploads is disabled...so I don't think mentioning that specifically will make a difference. Brion mentioned in bug 17035 that he wanted to fail when file_uploads is disabled. I mentioned failing along with $wgEnableUploads (and throwing a specific wfDebug for it), but he wanted to make it a separate fail message. It's welcome to improvements, if you can think of better wording. ^demon 03:06, 24 January 2009 (UTC)

Multiple !!FUZZY!!
Eventually this situation has already been corrected but I wonder if FuzzyBot shouldn't check if a message is already fuzzied before fuzzying it. Right now it's not uncommon to see the beginning of messages with !!FUZZY!!!!FUZZY!! (I already saw messages with 3 !!FUZZY!!). This is not a priority issue but it would be an improvement if multiple fuzzying would be avoided. Thanks, Malafaya 19:35, 18 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Personally, I find that sort of useful, since it indicates how many times the message has been changed since the original translation was made. Not to mention that if you did not update at the previous change, you might be interested in knowing that the message was changed once more. --Harald Khan Ճ  19:55, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Yep. Multiple fuzzy does server a purpose. It means *really* *really* outdated. Siebrand 20:08, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
 * If you guys think so, ok. For me, one !!FUZZY!! already means "check the whole message translation" :). Malafaya 23:07, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

OpenID
Usually its better to leave the term OpenID as it is so ignoring this item is logical... Am I correct? Yaron Shahrabani 07:41, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I think so. --fryed-peach 14:12, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Me, too. In other words: I made it so. Yet I added html markup giving it a  attribute, so as to have it correctly pronunced by screen readers and correctly indexed by search engines, etc.. --Purodha Blissenbach 08:50, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

should use PLURAL
This message should use PLURAL. --EugeneZelenko 15:17, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Done with mwr:45903. i Alex  16:38, 19 January 2009 (UTC)

and should be merged using PLURAL
These messages should be merged using PLURAL. --EugeneZelenko 15:25, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Btw. even two separate messages for cases of a variable being 1, or not 1, respectively, does not generally 'protect' against the need to use PLURAL in the "not 1" case, since PLURAL may do much more complex a branching than on "1" or "many" for some languages. --Purodha Blissenbach 08:42, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ mwr:46011. Raymond 10:47, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
 * What about the message on translatewiki? Deletion needed? Der Umherirrende 19:12, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Deletion is not necessary. They will be ignored by the export script. Raymond 18:21, 24 January 2009 (UTC)

Does it need translations? Should be optional? --fryed-peach 07:26, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ mwr:45919. Thanks. Siebrand 08:57, 20 January 2009 (UTC)

For this message there was no documentation because Fryed-peach blanked the /qqq page since that its content was ' ' and that template doesn't exist any more. So I deleted /qqq but in the message still appears information box with template. Why? Same problem with. --Darth Kule - Comlink 16:13, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
 * It may take a while before the caches are updated. Siebrand 16:50, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Deleted it from the i18n file... – Nike 19:50, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

Group statistics
The groups statistics page is incomplete. It has statistics for languages up to nl - Dutch. I hope it's a temporary problem. Cheers, Malafaya 00:22, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I rebuilt the stats earlier. Siebrand 11:15, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ Thanks, Malafaya 14:19, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

Where is this message used? --fryed-peach 07:34, 24 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Have not checked the code, but I am pretty certain that this will be used on geographic coordinates like 51° 28' 38" N. Siebrand 11:34, 24 January 2009 (UTC)
 * The format of coordinates is not localized, right? --fryed-peach 15:01, 24 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I do not think so, indeed. Siebrand 15:22, 24 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Thank you. --fryed-peach 16:44, 24 January 2009 (UTC)

Should it be optional? (the same content) is optional. --fryed-peach 18:25, 23 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ mwr:46093. Siebrand 19:27, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

should use PLURAL?
I think this message should use PLURAL if used with number. --EugeneZelenko 16:06, 24 January 2009 (UTC)
 * This message does not seem to be in use in "Social Profile - User Profile". It's probably obsolete. Malafaya 01:03, 25 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ Removed in mwr:46245. Siebrand 10:45, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

Special:Translations
Suggested rewordings: fieldset: Message input label: Name namespace label: Project – Nike 20:31, 24 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Looks sane. Best make it so... Siebrand 00:32, 25 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ mwr:46239. Siebrand 23:35, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

Users using English still have confusing message. – Nike 07:54, 25 January 2009 (UTC) Still unclear, who sees this message. If it is shown to plain every user, it should have a hint to contact a server admin added. --Purodha Blissenbach 12:59, 25 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ with release 46197.

, and other
I think this messages should use PLURAL if layout of statistics is number | message. --EugeneZelenko 16:17, 25 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ mwr:46238. Siebrand 23:25, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

Some messages in Semantic MediaWiki
,, and  seem to have following texts. Is it possible to modify them to contain following texts as parameters? The current word orders are hard to translate in Japanese. --fryed-peach 17:00, 25 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ mwr:46227. Siebrand 20:44, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

Please fuzzy this message after updating messages from SVN. English text required an ending colon. Thanks, Malafaya 01:16, 26 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ Siebrand 07:01, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

Please help The English version of appears incomprehensible to me. Its German equivalent certainly does not match the Engish. It is either improving on a poorly worded original, or just a wild guess, or it is the original itself, which was mistranslated to English. --Purodha Blissenbach 09:53, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Btw. needs rewording, having a "click here" type of anchor text - just in case, someone alters the i18 file anyways. --Purodha Blissenbach 09:58, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

Meanwhile, I believe, the message wants to say that, "a/the page/document/conatiner collecting the digital signature for this page has been established already, and you cannot initialize one/this one a second time."

A container collecting digital signatures is very close to a signature folder, I believe, a real life object I've seen being used in offices thoughout the world.

Thus, I have translated, and creatively extended and , to use this term in the   translation. Could that be an option to come to more understandable English, too? What do you think? --Purodha Blissenbach 11:19, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I have no clue. As you have given this some proper thought, I think the best way is to install the extension, give it a test run, and change the messages accordingly. Siebrand 20:03, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ I updated 2 messages in mwr:46251. Siebrand 11:11, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

Missing action-s for right-s
and

tell in their descriptions that, there were corresponding action-* messages, but they seem not to exist. --Purodha Blissenbach 01:13, 8 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Best add them, then... Siebrand 10:51, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ mwr:46250. Siebrand 10:58, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

and
I think we should unite this two messages in one and use parameter to pass actual link. Otherwise sentence is broken and there are many chances for incorrect translation. --EugeneZelenko 16:31, 10 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Not changing this, because a proper translation can be made, even though it may take a little puzzling... Siebrand 11:26, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

should use PLURAL
I think this message should use PLURAL. --EugeneZelenko 16:40, 10 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ mwr:46253. Siebrand 11:30, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

What do those variables mean? --fryed-peach 17:52, 13 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I think this is error message. 	I'm not sure, but it's possible the importance of such variables may be:
 * $1 - date/time
 * $2 - error code
 * $3 - php filename
 * $4 - line number
 * Sp5uhe 20:16, 13 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ Siebrand 11:36, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

FreeCol:Model.unit.occupation.fortified/en
Question: Beginning with FreeCol:Model.unit.occupation.fortified/en, what does each letter signify. The letters seem not to be consistent with what they stand for as I progress onwards on each message. I would appreciate a reply so I could translate them well (or assign the appropriate letter) in Tagalog (tl). Thank you in advance. - AnakngAraw 00:19, 23 January 2009 (UTC)
 * They are symbols, usually shorthand for the action a specific unit is doing on the map. You know if you have played this type of games. See for example the screenshot at http://www.freecol.org/images/screen-0.8.0-large.jpg – Nike 11:18, 23 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks. - AnakngAraw 18:45, 25 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ I added Niklas' explanation as a translation hint. Siebrand 10:53, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

$1 in this message is not localized? --fryed-peach 17:20, 23 January 2009 (UTC)
 * It's not. It seems to come from the HTTP request parameter "type". Malafaya 00:57, 25 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ Updated translation hint. Siebrand 10:54, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

Will be good idea to add documentation with parameters description. Also translations of Added and Removed depends on numbers of actual groups in $5 and $6 (PLURAL should be used). --EugeneZelenko 16:49, 10 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ Siebrand 11:42, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

CLDR
Is there no extension page on Meta for CLDR/LanguageNames extension? Would be useful. Is the extension ready to use on Wikimedia projects? (In other words: would it pass Brion's review?) --:Slomox:: &gt;&lt; 17:21, 10 January 2009 (UTC)
 * The point of review is to determine if it passes the review and this is qualified. If I would know the answer it wouldn't need review :D. And yes it should have a page describing what it is. Hopefully it will soon include timezones in addition to language names. – Nike 07:12, 14 January 2009 (UTC)


 * The creator of the extension would be predestined to add mw:Extension:CLDR, wouldn't he? ;-)
 * About the review, yep, I guess you are right. But it would be possible, that there are obvious reasons that suggest, the extension wouldn't pass review. Reasons that are not relevant on a tiny translation wiki but are relevant for a Top 10 website worldwide.
 * Does the CLDR extension support country names too or just languages?
 * I am asking these questions, cause I try to work on improved template localisation on Commons. CLDR extension would be useful for that. But there is few point in starting a poll or anything like that if the extension is not fit for the main live Wikimedia wikis. --:Slomox:: &gt;&lt; 17:25, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * 1) I'm lazy.
 * 2) Nothing that I am aware of, even the performance should be acceptable and brion actually has expressed interested to enable it
 * 3) No, but the data is there, it just need to be extracted and code to retrieve it needs to be written.
 * 4) If you have time to write that meta page and/or try to ask for a review, it would be great! See 1). – Nike 17:33, 16 January 2009 (UTC)


 * I created a basic page: mw:Extension:CLDR. Please check and feel free to add more (release log etc.) ;-) --:Slomox:: &gt;&lt; 14:20, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I had a look at the source code to look whether I would be able to modify the code to cover coutry names too, but the extension seems to work in a way different to any extension I know. I can't even find a hook that defines the parser function. I couldn't find anything like  (that's the way ParserFunctions for example is doing it ). Where is "languagename" defined? --:Slomox:: &gt;&lt; 14:39, 18 January 2009 (UTC)


 * The parser hook is actually in I18nTags extension, which calls a function in the cldr extension. – Nike 15:09, 18 January 2009 (UTC)


 * I was able to produce a working example of "countryname" by some modifications to your code. Have a look at . If you like, I can send you the code (but don't hit me for mauling your code ;-) ). --:Slomox:: &gt;&lt; 17:11, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
 * And when I already was trying to fit my head into Mediawiki code, I created another localisation improvement. I added a few lines to ParserFunctions, so you can provide a third parameter to that allows to specify a language code to render the output in that language (until now only content language was possible). It also supports user language by providing the language code 'mul'. Useful for multilingual projects. I have never added a line of code to Mediawiki, could you give me a hint, what's the right way to go, to have this inserted in the main code? --:Slomox:: &gt;&lt; 05:57, 21 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I'll try to answer soon. – Nike 07:59, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

Well, what comes to #time, better run it trough bugzilla. What comes to 'mul', I don't think it is suitable, as it means multilingual and not some random language the user wants to see. Also, it should probably not be done for the same reasons we don't have variables retrieving the interface language of current user (cache coherency etc.). If it is going to be implemented, it should use parser's funtionlang, which equals to interface language in interface messages, which is ok. – Nike 20:51, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

desc-message missing
I am missang some desc-message to translate. The Extension are:
 * ConfirmEdit Fancy Captcha - ? Problem: is not a separate extension. Raymond 16:46, 17 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Google Maps - ? ✅ Added. Raymond 16:46, 17 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Betawiki UI Messages - ?

The desc-message from this Extension are not used on Special:Translate:
 * Configure Setting - Problem: marked as optional. Dunno why. Raymond 16:46, 17 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Redirect - strange. Needs investigation. Raymond 16:46, 17 January 2009 (UTC) ✅ Siebrand 15:37, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

It is possible to change/add this, to have a full translate of an extension? --Der Umherirrende 19:48, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Betawiki UI is not an extension. – Nike 19:55, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Ok, but the desc can not translate, the same for MediaWiki messages (most used), Mantis, FreeCol, Voctrain, Mwlib.rl and Commonist on Special:Translate. What about the other desc-message? Is there any problem with the software or message? Der Umherirrende 10:58, 17 January 2009 (UTC)


 * is optional because the message is not used in the interface. We try to not burden translators with translations that are only used for bureaucratic purposes, like niceties in this wiki. As for {{msg|fancycaptcha-desc}: it is a separate message group, so it can have its own extension credits, and subsequently its own description message. Siebrand 15:40, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

✅ Siebrand 12:26, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

Can we separate this message to two messages, the title of Special:DeletedContributions and the link text used in Special:Special:Contributions? I would like to use a bit shorter text for the latter usecase like "Deleted contributions". --fryed-peach 18:56, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ added in mwr:46258. Copied contents from . Siebrand 13:20, 26 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Thank you! --fryed-peach 14:38, 26 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I think Special:SpecialPages should use . --fryed-peach 09:39, 27 January 2009 (UTC)
 * No, it should not. "-title" is a page title. Siebrand 11:56, 27 January 2009 (UTC)

Semantic MediaWiki in Korean
Please remove all translations in Korean from software. All translations are wrong. (machine translation).--Kwj2772 09:56, 21 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Who made those translations, and have you asked that translator about it? The proper solution would be to fix the translations, instead of removing them, by the way. Siebrand 11:22, 21 January 2009 (UTC)
 * From the file SMW_LanguageKo.php – Nike 19:46, 22 January 2009 (UTC)


 * ✅ mwr:46259. I would of course suggest to translate them properly as soon as possible. Siebrand 13:31, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

Probably needs to get a parameter, as I expect that currently a username is glued behind this. Siebrand
 * ✅ Siebrand 13:28, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

Highly problematic new message
While I understand the idea behind, I must suggest to either drop it entirely, or replace it by something else. The current concept does not work for several reasons:   If you want to use the native language name, also "version" has to be taken from that language, else you have mixed languages.   If "version" is indeed taken from the native language by some rather nonstandard routine, then inside the message $1 is in fact a constant, and should not be used.   This message is bound to be heavily depending on GRAMMAR in several languages, that I know. As for,  ,  , in the Babel context, I once counted the varios ways to use a language name as an adjective, if there are any at all. I don't recall the figure but there were quite some variations, here are some for :   Deutsch → Fassung auf Deutsch ↔ deutsche Version ↔ deutsche Fassung   Tagalog → Fassung auf Tagalog ↔ Tagalog-Version ↔ Tagalogfassung ↔ Fassung in Tagalog </li>  Nahuatl → Fassung auf Nahuatl ↔ Version in Nahuatl ↔ Fassung in Nahuatl </li>  Sprache von Nauru → Fassung in der Sprache von Nauru ↔ Version in der Sprache von Nauru </li> </ul> There are several possible variations for many languages, but there is not a single form which can be used throughout. :-( </li> </ul> The only possible simple solution, I found so far, is to translate " Version" as one message, have it retrieved at runtime from s message file (which I belive can be ressource-intensive since for pages having links to all languages, all but one (huge) language files need to be loaded just to retrieve a single message each from them) --Purodha Blissenbach 00:34, 24 January 2009 (UTC) — Danny B. 17:10, 24 January 2009 (UTC)
 * See also r46059 comments.
 * ✅ Was reverted. Siebrand 09:42, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

How language name itself will be localized? For example on Russian/Belarusian correct message will depend on language itself, for example, версия на русском языке for Russian version but версия на эсперанто for Esperanto version. Same for Belarusian and most likely for other Slavic languages. --EugeneZelenko 15:33, 23 January 2009 (UTC)


 * FYI: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Special:Code/MediaWiki/46059#code-comments – Nike 16:39, 23 January 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ Was reverted. Siebrand 09:42, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

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